Talk:Magnetic Accelerator Cannon/Archive

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I think the three metal plates under the Pillar Of Autumn could be its MAC canon, as described in Halo: The Fall of Reach --Climax Viod 10:56, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

File:PoA.jpg|250px|right|thumb|See at its base]]

What do you think ?

  • Yeah i think that looks right --Xeon 800--
  • I think you could be right.--Ryanngreenday 20:34, 23 October 2006 (UTC)
  • I agree, it most likley is. If it's not... what else could it be? - Knuxchao
  • Yeah I agree with it too, its the closest we've gotten to knowing where the MAC Gun is on the Pillar of Autumn, and it looks big enough for it to be a MAC gun too. User:Joshua 029

I Think those plates are just protection to the bridge. in halo combat evolved wasnt there like a big glass plate to see out of?-Mitch

Should i add this to the MAC article ? --Climax Viod 15:27, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

Are you sure?

poaob1.png Are we really sure this is the right place for the MAc? This image seems like a good place too....--User:JohnSpartan117 [1] 23:27, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

Thats what ive been saying --Climax Viod 14:46, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Actualy after rethinking this i believe this to be wrong --Climax Viod 21:08, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

For anyone who still thinks the muzzle is at the three metal plates, check out the picture of the Marathon class: marathonclasscruiserae9.jpg

At first, you may say "The Marathon class has 3 MACs, and there are three distinct metal plated thingies. They must be the muzzles!" But look again. The third plating thingy near the stern would clearly have to shoot right through the second one, making it impossible that the metal plates represent the MAC muzzles. 74.113.238.25 05:56, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Metal plates indicate something that needs protecting, and as MAC openings would need protecting, (You wouldn't want the muzzle to be damaged, have the shell hit the imperfections in the muzzle and damage the ship with the impact, would you?) muzzles for MAC cannons are something that extra armour can indicate on all ships equipped with such. --DRS Airwolf 14:47, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

The Bridge isn't even near those plates. Watch the intro to Combat Evolved. The bridge is the box on the forward tier, below the dual guns. The MAC is a tunnel that goes through the length of the whole ship. The muzzle is the forward most tier, in the direct center of the ships bow. You need to remember that these ships are massive. The bridge is relatively small and those plates are too large for it to be protecting that. Besides, if you've read the books, Keyes is always complaing his Bridge is unprotected. My educated guess is leaning towards the plates being used for space docking. MAC guns are protected well, by the ENTIRE hull of the ship. The MArathon and Holcyon Classes aren't exactly the same and differ on dozens of counts. Don't use them as interchangable resources for information. You are all partially correct and partially wrong on all parts. --Spartan-150 15:27, 17 April 2009 (UTC)


File:PoAedl.JPG|left|thumb|200px]] i believe that either of the se woul be the place of the MAC b/c if you look how large the barrel is on the Super MACs, then this would have to be the location b/c the barrel would have to run almost the full length of the ship, b/c if it was at the bottom then it would be like firing a pistol at a blast door considering the amount of power that it would build up when in comparison to a MAC and a covvie cruiser, so it would need a much larger barrel e.g the 2 that are designated i would think it is the bottom of th e2 b/c it looks more barrel like and dark.(i suspect it is the same place on the marathons single MAC as there is no bottom part like the HAlcyons kk cheers,....... J!MMY8806 22:04, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Page 272 of Halo: The Fall of Reach says "Captain Keyes drifted toward the stern and noticed concealed and recessed 50mm autocannons for defense against single ships. Underneath were bumps-part of the linear accelerator system for the ships lone MAC gun." This implies the MAC to be somewhere around the underbelly. Also, the Super MAC is much longer that a regular MAC, being that a regular MAC is an underpowered Super MAC. A shipboard MAC does not single-shot a Covenant ship.

--RotBrandon 00:54, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
Actually, that quote means nothing at all. It doesn't imply that the MAC launch tube is in the underbelly of the PoA, all it says is that part of the acceleration system is located there. I have a lingering suspicion that the only reason ships are designed for a specific length is for the MAC launch tube. After all, why else would the UNSC make all its vessels bilaterally symmetrical and have a straight line from stern bow for placing a MAC tube in? 74.113.238.25 03:19, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

i know that, but it would still have to be of considerable size and if it were at the bottom the barrel would run through the centre of the ship in between the lifepods, yes. so it would have to have some sort of damage of them + with the engines bieng as big as they are i suspect a massive drive system for them located behind them so the actual length of the MAC if it was at the bottom would be around 150-400m which doesnt seam like enough room to fit a weapon that is suppose to be able to nuetralize a ships shealds or destroy a UNSC ship in 1, kk just a though thanks mate, J!MMY8806 14:42, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Actually, the quote could mean something. A coilgun's acceleration system is placed around the barrel, and evenly on opposite sides, so if part of the acceleration system reached that far down but the barrel was much further up, it would mean the entire height of the Autumn would be filled with the coilgun's acceleration system, something I highly doubt. As for damage to the lifepods, magnetic material will stop a magnetic field, so just encase the MAC in iron or steel and you have very good shielding so long as the casing is thick enough. Also, the barrel would not be very far across, (I remember 5 or 6 metres mentioned somewhere, probably in another part of this page, but on the Cairo it looks closer to 1 to 1.5 metres, so that needs clearing up by someone.) so the magnetic field inside the coils would be very powerful due to close proximity to them, however, it would be much weaker outside, due to the fact outside is not surrounded by the coil on all sides. Not sure how clear that explanation was, so if it isn't very then to anyone who understands it, feel free to explain better. --DRS Airwolf 14:47, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
And also, the Forward Unto Dawn is only around 300m, by estimations I have made on the last H3 level, yet its MAC is still considered powerful enough to be of use. On the Autumn, if we assume where the rear bulge starts is where all engine mechanisms start, and the MAC's barrel ends at the plating, this gives it 500m, perhaps 600m length, around double what the FuD's is. (estimated from the PoA's length being 1.17 km, which can still be disputed) --DRS Airwolf 14:35, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

The Pillar of Autumn uses Magentic Feild Recyclers and Booster Capacitors to fire 3 succive shots with one charge. It does not have 3 guns. Fall of Reach page 275. --UNSC AI 02:02, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Question here

Super Macs are the best defense we have against the covenant... Instead of building all these non-essential weapons like the frigate... Why dont we make ships bigger than Marathon Cruisers that have the capabilities of having enough size to feature something like a Super-Mac Cannon. It's wierd... A fanfiction must be written on this! xD Later. CaptainAdamGraves 02:07, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

or even better. Put slipspace and regular engines on MAC platforms! :P --UNSC AI 02:09, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

or at least strap on some defensive weapons like the standard 50mm point defence guns and archer missiles pods. if they had these then the Athens and Malta would still exist...as would all the brave souls abourde them at the time. Maiar 06:44, 19 April 2009 (UTC)
This is exactly why I dont see this the way Halo is as being how realistically we would be in a balls to walls fight for humanity. Wouldn't we strive for the biggest and best shit possible? Like in world war II, because we became a militaristic based nation, we made the best things. If we become a militaristic race, wouldn't we be into crazy big things? And yes, I dont understand why the MAC-Stations are stationary, its stupid... Grrrr.... CaptainAdamGraves 03:11, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
Thing of it. putting a Super MAC on one huge ship may seem like a good idea, in theory. but what's the Covenant's first target going to be? they'd blow it out of space before it could even charge the MAC! which i would imagine would take a while! Frigates are smaller, faster, and cheaper to make, which is why they're still used at all.
I agree. Also, it would take years (and dont forget the money) to make just 1 of them as a ship. This would be due to the testing of a Slipspace drive powerfull to push an item, atleast over a mile in diamatre. If my calculations are correct, any slipspace engine able to push a super MAC to FTL, would instantly, or almst instantly be blown into subatomic particles. -- - Forerunner 21:45 19/01/07

i have an idea why dont the humans get a super mac platform add alot of battleplate, archer missles, a couple of nukes,a reactor,and engines and call it a capital ship? think about it it could destroy any covenant ship while still being able to dodge the plasma torpedos, pulse lasers, and energy projectors the covenant ship could throw at it. After all marathon class cruisers are about the same length as a super MAC platform.


Actually, you are wrong, and I daresay, talking out of your ass. How can you make "calculations" about technology which we have no theoretical concept about? Predict what happens through objects travelling through IMAGINARY dimensions using IMAGINARY technology that nobody really understands?. You can't. Besides, large objects are provably able to enter and travel through slipspace successfully: High Charity manages to do without "instantly be blown into subatomic particles." We have been shown no upper size limit on what can travel through slipspace. 74.113.238.25 03:23, 12 April 2007 (UTC)
That point is true. It is stated in the novels that ships are only capable of moving through slipspace BECAUSE of their high mass; in First Strike, the Covenant Spirit dropship is almost shaken to pieces due to its low mass. From various points like this, I believe that the idea is in slipspace, the massier the object is, the more it "stabilizes" the imaginary dimensions, to allow things to exist there. DRS Airwolf

The thing is MAC Stations use broadcast power to charge thier capacitors--UNSC AI 21:37, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

Well it seems the Super-MAC is superior to Covenant weapons so why not make the Super-MAC mobile like Slipspace engines so defending Super-Macs when all is lost can jump to another system like Earth if Reachs Macs woulkd have jumped would have had 320 Super-Macs

Frigates and Destroyers are essential to the UNSC fleet because they are fast an maneuverable. The MAC station could not avoid being a primary target. The smaller ships have MAC guns. -ED 19:13, 10 March 2007 (UTC)
Super-MAC's need ground-based generators, ferrying the energy needed to power the massively powerful MAC's, to operate. how would they carry them around with them? if they were made smaller, they'd take ages to recharge, and by then the enemy's plasma volley will have wiped them out. by far the best method is to stick to smaller, more manoeuvrable, cheaper ships rather than big, unwieldy things that would be obliterated. -- SpecOps306 07:12, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
thats why they put reactors ON BOURD. like someone up there already said numbnuts. and braudcast power is realy inneficiant so a reactor on the actual station would run better. Maiar 06:47, 19 April 2009 (UTC)
I don't know what I said to be called "numbnuts," besides point out the truth. The power requirements for railguns are enormous, and I'm willing to bet that generators for them are kilometers across - you really want to mount that on a capital ship, making it a massive target, possibly spraying any nearby ships with debris and radiation? Then there's manoeuvrability - a ship would have difficulty manoeuvring a weapon that size. As for power transmission, try reading this article. Would running a three-hundred-kilometer long cable between the generator and platform be more efficient? -- Administrator Specops306 - Qur'a 'Morhek 23:14, November 23, 2009 (UTC)

To answer the original question, why doesn't America use M1 Abrams and nothing else? Many reasons. The simplest of which is money. Then you have the fact that these MACs take an incredible amount of energy to fire. Then the fact that the slugs they fire are very hard to make. Then you have the fact that the Covenant had found ways around it. If all we had was MACs we'd have to wait to be attacked. We'd be unable to lure the Covenant away from others. Then you have the fact that would make our troops worthless, leaving them to die on the planet when its glassed. Then, all the MACs on orbital stations draw their energy from groundside reactors. As with Reach, once those reactors go out, the planet falls. Your thinking on this isn't logical. I don't beleive that humanity wasn't dependent enough on MACs, I beleive they were too dependent.--Spartan-150 15:31, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

The reasons the larger MACs are not built in bulk are many. For one, these are massive weapons, and as we've seen are very, very tempting targets. Why waste that many resources on something that's going to be out of the battle in the first or second exchange? There is also the time constraints to building so many. Sgt Johnsons said that when he shipped out for basic, some 25 odd years before the events of Halo 2, the platforms had not even begun to be built. This means that it takes a very, very long time to make even 1 of them, let alone sufficient numbers to compete against the numbers the Covenant could throw. Another reason is energy. Each Orbital Defense Platform required such a large reactor to charge it, they had to be built on the ground where the energy was transfered into orbit to charge the cannons. Yet another reason is that such a large cannon would require a massive superstructure around it to not only keep the thing from shaking itself apart just by firing, but also to armor and protect it from enemy fire. On the flip side of such large size, it would require massive engines to even get it moving, and because of its mass it would take a rather long time to even maneuver it. Creating a fleet of Super MAC warships was simply impossible to create at the time of the Covenant war, especially when you had to keep up the fleet to defend against attacks, as well as when shipyard after shipyard was falling to the enemy. Perhaps after the Covenant war, this could be possible, but it would be unwise, as such massive ships are cumbersome, targets for enemy fire, and would be extremely expensive to not only build, but keep supplied, especially on the frontlines.

Not railguns

The MAC isn't a railgun. It's actually a coilgun. There's a difference. I could explain it, but you could also look it up on Wikipedia.

Rail Guns are a fast firing Magnetic accelerated bullets ain't they. to this MAC would be like magnetic accelerating cannon shell right? just saying makes sense DeadReanimation 11:23, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

The Name

Many people call this the MAC cannon. When MAC stands for Magnetic Accelerator Cannon, why do people add a "cannon" after it? They are technically calling it "the Magnetic Accelerator Cannon cannon". I could rant on about how they call it the MAC gun also, but I seem to have reached my point. -Blemo 02:50, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

It's like the La Brea Tar Pits, literally meaning "The The Tar Tar Pits." It's weird English stuff that doesn't make sense. --Dragonclaws(talk) 05:09, 12 April 2007 (UTC)
Or an ATM Machine. (Automatic Teller Machine Machine.) Just go with it.

When you speak of the Sahara, do you say "Sahara"? Or "Sahara Desert"? Sahara means desert. Its the same logic. People simply add things to the simpler names to reaffer what they're saying. If you know nothing about Halo, would you know the MAC is a Cannon? Or would I have to tell you?--Spartan-150 15:24, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Numbers

I was looking at the page, and it says that the Super Magnetic Accelerator Cannon is "capable of accelerating a 3000 ton ferric-tungsten round to 40% the speed of light, or 179 875 474.8 kilometers/s (74,512.9 miles/s)." Since this is neither the correct number nor the correct magnitude, I thought that I should point it out. The speed of light is 299 792 458 meters/s or approximately 300 000 000 m/s. 40% of this number would be 120 000 000 m/s or 120 000 kilometers/s.


Odd. I was going through the Halo: Fall or Reach paperback, and on page 283, the Super MACs accelerated "three-thousand ton projectiles" to "point four-tenths the speed of light". I see that not as 0.4C, but as (0.4/10)C, or 0.04C. --Some Sci-Fi guy 6-27-2007

It could be useful if someone with the books or whatever could find the reference where it gives the muzzle speed of the 'standard' MAC (currently 0.1 c in the article). If the SMAC is 0.04 c then some very interesting things start happening once one plugs in the numbers. Namely: the SMAC produces slightly less KE than the MAC, but about 2 times the momentum. (That would imply something about Covenant shielding too, no?) On the other hand, if it turns out the MAC is only, say, 0.01 c then everything works out to the original expectation (i.e. that the SMAC is heads and shoulders above the MAC in all ways.) 74.99.140.28 20:04, 27 June 2007 (UTC)


I would tend to think that it's actuall 0.01C, not 0.1C, since while a shipboard MAC is linked to the power systems that drive the ship (it has to share juice with sensors, propulsion, life support, etcetera) a Super MAC just sits there and blows the crap out of things. Of course, there's always the possibility that Nylund meant either "four tenths" or "point four", but seeing that he's a good writer and the books are pretty much error-free, I'm sticking with Nylund actually meaning .04C 75.61.142.8 00:23, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Were did the shipboard MAC numbers come from? What page, of which book? The only thing that I remember from reading the books was that in “The Fall of Reach” page 107 “The MAC - Magnetic Acceleration Cannon - was the (ship’s) main weapon. It fired a super-dense ferric tungsten shell. The tremendous Mass and velocity of the projectile obliterated most ships on impact.” The exact weight and speed was never stated as far as I can remember.

I was re-reading "The Fall of Reach," on page 108, after the first description of how a MAC works, the velocity of the projectile is given as 30,000 m/s which is 0.01% the speed of light. However, I have not been able to find a reference to the mass of a MAC slug in FoR. "Contact Harvest" page 119 gives the mass as 160 metric tons. Given that the ship in "Fall of Reach" was a frigate and Contact Harvest is set in 2525, its possible that larger, more powerful MACs like the one mounted on the Pillar of Autumn could fire a 600 ton slug, but I just can't find the actual reference and it's bugging me. So i