Talk:Sangheili: Difference between revisions

Okay, rather than pointing out the many flaws in your argument's logic in a long list, I'll just go over the essential points. Humanity didn't lose all of their worlds--a good number of the Inner Colonies were outright never even contested, as the Covenant went straight after Reach, then Earth, within the span of less than a year. Losing a war does not mean you are less competent at warfare, or even that your military is inferior. Here's an example: The Winter War. Finland against Soviet Russia, one on one. Despite having inferior technology, vastly inferior numbers, and no ability to go on the offensive, Finland avoided total defeat and inflicted a casualty ratio of more than 4-to-1. Why? Because of vastly superior tactics, strategy, use of available tech/resources, and ingenuity. In the Halo 'verse, humanity uses superior tactics and strategy than the Covenant every. single. time. Why do they ever lose? The Covenant have vastly superior technology, numbers, and insurmountable strategic initiative. The Fall of Reach? A vastly outnumbered and outgunned UNSC force inflicted vastly disproportionate casualties through the use of far superior tactics, strategy, intelligence, organization, and ingenuity. Name a battle, and the Covenant either lose against all odds or win with far heavier losses (or with far less efficiency) than any half-competent tactician/commander/force should. And it's not rocket science as to why--religious fanatics raised in a society built upon corruption, superstitious feelings, caste-based governing and rule, advancement-by-faith-or-feats, and an honor-bound warrior-culture that pits soldiers in duels to the death as part of training and selection are extremely unlikely to make good tacticians or leaders. When a harsh code of honor completely overrides rationalism, pragmatism, or survival (and even victory), you are not a good tactician; at best, you're good in spite of all those things. Okay, next; the Elites were the best fighting force in the galaxy because they hadn't been defeated? Not only is that not true (they lost to the Prophets, in large part because they--irrationally--refused to even study the highly advanced Forerunner relics for religious/dogmatic reasons, something that the Prophets themselves had no problem doing), but their toughest competition after that defeat was the Jackals--and in this case, it took a while for the Elites to wear down disorganized groups of pirates whose ships weren't even capable of FTL (and even then, the war ended when the Prophets struck a deal to basically give the Jackals a small degree of autonomy and monetary dispensation for their services). The Hunters? The Elites got their asses kicked on the ground, and resorted to threatening orbital bombardment to get victory--against a race that had no combat spacecraft at all, or colonies. Grunts? Similar story. The Brutes were fairly willing to join without being at the end of a gun. As for the super advanced technology they ''do'' possess, it's pretty much a given that the vast majority of it comes from the Prophets and/(perhaps OR)Engineers, who are basically 'do everything for you, including self-replicate and self-educate' supercomputer engineers that already know a good deal about Forerunner tech. And after the end of the H-C War, the Elites can't even build new ships because they don't know how (says a lot, there). Until the Prophets completely drop off the map, the Brutes are actually winning against the Elites because the Prophets help them keep building ships. As for treating the Elites, an entire race, as a single person for stereotyping purposes--I'm not doing that; the article in its current form ''does'', describing all Elites as intelligent, very strong, cunning warriors with intense bravery (and so forth). The problem is, you can't find more than a handful of Elites that match that description, but you can very easily find countless examples of ones that contradict it. The only cases of Elites winning battles/engagements through superior tactics/intelligence are against Brutes--who are repeatedly demonstrated to be quite stupid in most areas (though to be fair, I'm sure a good deal of that is due to deficiencies in their culture, society, governing systems, etc, not so much to biology) and have only been using Covenant-level tech for a few decades, compared to the centuries/millennia for Elites. Oh, and remember Thel's first mission as the Arbiter? That clever/suicidally brave idea he came up with for dealing with the Heretic faction and its leader? The fact that it wasn't the ''first'' idea they had is alarmingly stupid/irrationally dense of them. In most cases, the tactical skill level that Elites show is an adept understanding of animalistic, hunting-style methodology against small groups of prey. In naval battles, they literally prefer to charge head-on into close combat regardless of the nuances or details of the situation. It says a great deal when the highest-ranked Elite soldiers fight like shock-troops, individually, on the front lines wielding swords in a battlefield of guns, explosives, vehicles, and many kinds of fire and air support--not commanding or leading, but personally rushing into the fray with a knife in a gunfight. [[User talk:SaltyWaffles|SaltyWaffles]] 17:21, 30 October 2012 (EDT)SaltyWaffles