Talk:Plasma turret

Writing
It sounds to me like what is being reffered to in this article is a Pulse laser turret as they are said to have insect like antena. Another part of the article states: The Plasma Turrent is a powerful Covenant starship weapon. It fires a spear of Plasma and can strike at almost any range, upon contact it causes sever damage to a target and can be used in conjusion with the Plasma torprdos, and Energy Projectors to desamate an entire human fleet. It can also be used to desamate Starfighters and ground forces. The spear of plasma sounds like the modification that cortana made to ascendant justice's plasma turrets in HFS...??? It then continues to state: Before the weapon fires it first has to charge, When the weapon charges, a ball of super heated plasma formes in front of the turrent, then after about 3 seconds it fires outward at its target. From a distance mutable balls of plasma can be seen forming and then streack forward at there targeat almost tracking the ship, and enough shots can destory the vessel. Now they're are saying that it DOSENT fire a spear but a tracking ball of plasma which sounds alot like the plasma torpedo to me... I suggest that there be some kind of merge and cleanup of this article and plasma torpedo. - 343 Guilty Spark


 * The "spear of plasma" sounds to me like sphere of plasma, which implies a round circular shape cimilar to a "ball of super heated plasma". You'll note there are several other spelling errors throughout the article, so reading between the lines is necessary. As for the article itself, this sounds like either a pulse turret or a plasma torpedo, but could be justified. From what I can tell, the Covenant plasma torpedo is a tracking ball of plasma that dissipates when the firing ship is destroyed. Now, when the ships at Reach release their plasma, it doesn't dissipate after the ships are destroyed and turns several Super MAC guns to molten slag. From this, one could infer two things, either this is a new weapon being mentioned, or a discrepency. I like the new weapon theory better.--Rot 01:05, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Size
All the plasma turrent is just the smallest weapon on a covenant vessel, and all of the turrents look alike?--Darth nexes 23:23, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Do you have any sources? 343 guilty Spark 23:46, 26 November 2006

Any one can edit this page, if you feel this is not acurit data you can change it, I did not add phisics, and no it is not the same as a plasma torpedo, this is just a weapon for taking out starfighters--Darth nexes 05:10, 28 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I will add physics. And there is nothing that says the turret is an AA gun. In fact, they missed a C709 'Sword and a Pelican over the remnants of Alpha Halo in First Strike. Cheers,  Relentless  Recusant [[Image:Jedi_Order.jpg|20px]] 17:51, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Pulse laser turret vs. plasma turret
isnt this the same weapon that is known as the Pulse laser turret --User:J!MMY8806 00:20, 23 December 2006

It is my belief that, since we see some plasma dissipating when a ship is destroyed (the plasma torpedo, as this plasma is guided), while we also see some plasma just continue on its course as a sort of blob after its ship is destroyed (like those fired at the Super MAC guns at Reach by kamakazees), that thus the Plasma Turret and Plasma Torpedo are separate weapons. I don't know about size, but they are separate. And the Pulse laser turret is a laser used for point defense, not a blob of plasma, thus separating the Plasma Turret and the Pulse laser turret.
 * --RotBrandon 00:09, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Question
It's stated that all covenant ships have them, but yet in the armanent for most of the ships this information isn't stated? :s

Cleanup
I've tidied up the physics section to bring it more in line with the descriptions on the books as well as adding a source. There seems to be some confusion over what this weapon is, most of the article describes the ship based weapon which we mostly get to know the insides of in First Strike as Cortana works out the plasma turrets on the Ascendent Justice. However the middle section refers to the mounted gun on the Spectre which is clearly a different weapon entirely - it is much smaller but it's not a scaled down version as its behaviour is nothing like it, it rapdily fires small bursts of plasma not the large guided charges those on the ship fire.--Johnmcl7 03:47, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

Separate
I think we need to split this article into two different ones: "Plasma turret" and "Plasma torpedo". Much of the links across this wiki are referring to plasma torpedos, so it seems odd that it would direct to a page about the firing device rather than the projectile. After all, we don't link the "14.5x114mm" page to the "Sniper rifle" page because ammunition and the weapon to fire it are two different things. A similar example is the separate pages we have "Fuel Rod" and "Fuel Rod Gun". The two subjects discussed in this page thus should be split. Tuckerscreator (stalk ) 18:20, 22 October 2011 (EDT)


 * They actually used to be two separate articles, but they were merged for a number of reasons. For example, there was a lot of overlapping information in the articles. Unlike bullets or fuel rods, plasma torpedoes are not physical projectiles but plasma blobs of indeterminate shape and size. A bullet or a fuel rod also has properties that are not directly tied to the weapon that fires them; a plasma torpedo, on the other hand, is only created from a given amount of plasma once the turret fires it, and has no properties of its own; everything about the torpedo, from its guiding mechanism to its very existence, is controlled by the weapon, which is not the case with normal projectiles. Having an article for plasma torpedoes is more akin to having one for the bolts fired by the plasma rifle or plasma launcher, for example. --Jugus (Talk  | Contribs ) 04:31, 27 October 2011 (EDT)

Ahh. Well, I guess that makes sense then, though it seems a little misleading considering most links to this page are referring directly to the projectile. Tuckerscreator (stalk ) 17:38, 27 October 2011 (EDT)

Mortal Dictata
I thought about it and... while plasma turrets generate plasma torpedoes, it would not be too unreasonable to think that perhaps some plasma torpedoes are indeed physical. It could be like the concussion rifle, it's a plasma weapon but it uses 'rounds'. Just a possibility perhaps. Erickyboo (talk) 01:22, 22 May 2014 (EDT)
 * Were that the intent, you'd still think they'd acknowledge the existence of the two types at some point. In Mortal Dictata, they refer to the physical "torpedoes" as if they were the norm. From an off-universe perspective, it's also a matter of clarity. I don't see why anyone would want to confuse people by using the same name for two weapons with fundamentally different workings, rather than just call the other by a different name; "plasma missiles" for example. --Jugus (Talk  | Contribs ) 01:47, 22 May 2014 (EDT)

So, according to this, plasma torpedoes are a tertiary weapon system and separate from the secondary "anterior plasma cannons". What's more, they're apparently launched from "silos". Both of these statements seem strange in light of the novels where there's never any indication that the plasma torpedo turrets are subsidiary to some other form of plasma cannon, unless this arrangement is unique to the CAS-class or the Song of Retribution; the torpedoes are always described as Covenant warships' primary offensive weapons (or secondary, if you count the energy projectors). What's more, calling the torpedoes' launch systems "silos" is somewhat eyebrow-raising considering their rather exhaustively defined launch mechanisms (collected along external plasma conduits/lines and then fired from a turret) — I don't see how you get "silo" from that, unless you want to slavishly roll with archaic wet navy terms. Hopefully the tabletop game's fluff will go into more detail about this. --Jugus (Talk  | Contribs ) 00:55, 23 February 2015 (EST)


 * It may be something like the Plasma Launcher, shooting physical projectiles loaded into a torpedo tube, that explode in a cloud of plasma when they strike. If they are, then that may explain how the UNSC CIWS systems haven't been made totally redundant - I don't know what kind of damage a railgun does to a teardrop of superheated plasma encapsulated in a magnetic field, but I doubt it's much. Hitting a torpedo on the other hand, may be a more straightforward affair. --  Qura 'Morhek   The Autocrat     of Morheka   03:33, 23 February 2015 (EST)


 * I think the UNSC's inability to do anything about plasma torpedoes was sort of the point, and one of the reasons the Covenant dominated space engagements. I can also see UNSC point defense weaponry being relevant against incoming boarding craft and fighters, even if they can't do a thing against torpedoes. Regardless I dearly hope they won't be retconning the torpedoes' nature because of Mortal Dictatas mistake or game balance. It could also be that they'll do just that, while providing us a convoluted explanation about how there are both physical and Nylundian plasma torpedoes and for some reason they call them both the same thing. --Jugus' (Talk  | Contribs ) 11:03, 23 February 2015 (EST)


 * Only speculating myself, but what about the kinds of retractable plasma turrets seen in The Package? Those turrets would retract into cylindrical housings that could be justified as silos perhaps. It needn't mean the plasma torpedo itself is anything physical in terms of solid matter. -ScaleMaster117 (talk) 14:18, 23 February 2015 (EST)


 * I recall the retractable turrets being pulse lasers (while the torpedo-like guided plasma shots are fired from unseen weaponry on the top side of the ship). However, I'm not fully sure if we see the torpedo turrets since I haven't seen The Package in ages. But I agree that "silo" doesn't necessarily mean the torpedoes are physical, just that I found the wording somewhat odd and perhaps misleading. I think this image from Halo Wars: Genesis comes closest to representing how the plasma torpedoes and their launch systems are described in the books: there are supposed to be visible "lines" on the hull of the ship where the plasma is collected before firing, which aren't depicted in any other visual media (though there are lots of seams and grooves on Covenant ships' hulls, some of which supposedly fill with plasma during battle). First Strike clearly describes the plasma being fired from "turrets" adjoining the lines on multiple occasions, while Ghosts of Onyx seems to do away with the turrets altogether and has the plasma lines "detaching" from a ship's hull as they fire; however, these descriptions don't necessarily preclude the existence of a turret even though they ignore it. --Jugus (Talk  | <font color="Gray">Contribs ) 01:28, 24 February 2015 (EST)


 * Could you not consider a Wraith's 'turret' fires a plasma 'torpedo'? The shipboard equivalent is larger but it would seem like it's a super large version of a Wraith's cannon. The fact that they're guided as in the Package shot you linked could be explained by the same process that allows Plasma Pistol charged shots track. -ScaleMaster117 (talk) 07:24, 24 February 2015 (EST)


 * I agree the technologies are probably linked as a lot of Covenant tech seems to be based around the same principles, only applied on different scales. Interestingly, plasma torpedoes also have manual guidance systems as seen in Ghosts of Onyx where Linda uses them to intercept a pair of incoming torpedoes (p. 224-225). However, I would assume they can be automatically targeted as well, much like a plasma pistol's charged shots. --<font color="MidnightBlue">Jugus (<font color="Gray">Talk  | <font color="Gray">Contribs ) 07:40, 24 February 2015 (EST)

"Anterior plasma cannons"
Since the plasma torpedoes have spun off into a separate discussion of their own, I thought I'd open up another one for the secondary plasma cannon system mentioned on Waypoint's Song of Retribution page. Like I said above, I don't recall the novels making a distinction between two different layers of plasma weaponry on Covenant ships so the labeling of plasma torpedoes as a tertiary system struck me as odd. Could the anterior plasma cannons be the ones that fire the smaller, unguided blue plasma bolts we see the Shadow of Intent firing on Halo 3's The Covenant, the ones fired by the Covenant corvettes in Halo: Reach, or even the shots impacting the Autumn in Halo CE? We've previously understood all of those as a form of plasma torpedo but they could conceivably be a different weapon system, particularly given their unguided nature. Maybe the general rule is that the blue ones are plasma cannon bolts while the red ones are plasma torpedoes? --<font color="MidnightBlue">Jugus (<font color="Gray">Talk  | <font color="Gray">Contribs ) 01:28, 24 February 2015 (EST)


 * Without much else to go on, I would guess that the plasma cannons are the weapons we see being used by the heavy corvette. I remember reading (I believe if was FoR) that plasma torpedoes were reserved for more powerful warships, destroyers and up, which made their presence on a corvette a bit odd. If they end up being reclassified as unguided plasma cannons instead, that might resolve that issue. --  Qura 'Morhek   The Autocrat     of Morheka   02:21, 24 February 2015 (EST)


 * It would also explain why the Autumn wasn't completely gutted by those blue (unguided-looking) plasma bolts. As stated in the article's trivia section, in Halo: The Flood, Captain Keyes implies that a single plasma torpedo would've turned the Autumn into "free-floating molecules," and as such surmises that the weapons the Covenant are using to attack the ship cannot be plasma torpedoes. --<font color="MidnightBlue">Jugus (<font color="Gray">Talk  | <font color="Gray">Contribs ) 07:48, 24 February 2015 (EST)

Heat-seeking plasma torpedoes
In Halo: Hunters in the Dark the corvette Mayhem uses plasma cannons to fire heat-seeking plasma torpedoes. This is either a mistake or it means corvettes can fire heat-seeking torpedoes from plasma cannons and not just weak unguided bolts. Should the page be changed or do you think it is a discrepancy? -- Topal the Pilot   ( Talk ) 19:57, 5 July 2015 (EDT)
 * Most likely it's a case of different corvettes possessing different weaponry. 343i has lately emphasized that Covenant ship manufacturing methods allow easy customization during construction, so it wouldn't be too much of a stretch that the Mayhem was outfitted with more powerful weapons than the SDV-class corvettes we see in Reach. That, or it was a different class of corvette altogether. Yet another possibility is that the non-homing bolts in Reach were just a game engine thing and the SDV's cannons are in fact capable of firing homing torpedoes. Hard to say with all the possibilities, and it doesn't help that the terminology surrounding the torpedoes is all over the place anyway. --<font color="MidnightBlue">Jugus (<font color="Gray">Talk  | <font color="Gray">Contribs ) 00:48, 8 July 2015 (EDT)
 * Do you know of any other mention of heat-seeking torpedoes, or is this the first time we've seen them? -- Topal the Pilot  UNSC insignia (post-war).png ( Talk ) 01:34, 8 July 2015 (EDT)
 * I'm not sure if that's ever been explicitly mentioned. I think the torpedoes are suggested to be computer-guided most of the time, though GoO reveals they can be guided by hand. Heat-seeking can be added to the article as one known guidance mechanism, though. --<font color="MidnightBlue">Jugus (<font color="Gray">Talk  | <font color="Gray">Contribs ) 01:40, 9 July 2015 (EDT)

Title image
I don't think we can be sure if the infobox image and its description are accurate. As per the "Terminology" section, we don't actually know if the projectiles launched by the SDV-class's cannons are classified as plasma torpedoes, especially seeing as they're unguided and some recent fiction makes a distinction between "plasma cannons" and "plasma torpedoes". I originally had this picture as the title image because we know for a fact it depicts plasma torpedoes instead of a possibly separate weapon system. It's not fully accurate (in that the beams seem to move in a straight line rather than arcs) but it comes closer to the books' descriptions with its inclusion of the glowing plasma lines on the ship's hull and the plasma's red color. --<font color="MidnightBlue">Jugus (<font color="Gray">Talk  | <font color="Gray">Contribs ) 14:33, 27 March 2016 (EDT)


 * The Reach image holds the advantage to me by being more detailed, more recent, and from a more creator-supported source. Maybe there could be a compromise where the page alternates between the two images, but if push comes to shove then I vote for the Reach one. Tuckerscreator (<font color="#008000">stalk ) 16:15, 27 March 2016 (EDT)


 * I remember seeing a very good image from The Package that illustrated the capabilities of plasma torpedoes, which was a barrage of torpedoes fired dorsally and then arcing around the ship to aim at the Spartans. I can't find it right now, and it's after midnight where I am anyway, but that might be a good fit for the article infobox image.
 * Edit: found it! --  Qura 'Morhek   The Autocrat     of Morheka   08:20, 28 March 2016 (EDT)

Rename to "Plasma torpedo"
I know it was originally I who championed the inclusion of all information on plasma torpedoes under the current title for reasons I listed in an earlier post on this page. However, I feel that the muddling of the different terms in more recent sources of canon (plasma turrets, plasma cannons, etc.) has made it more appropriate to just call this page "plasma torpedo" so it's clear what this page is about. I also feel that there should be a separate page for the starship plasma cannons mentioned on Waypoint's ship pages and in Fleet Battles (refer to above discussions for elaboration). I don't think we need a separate article for the plasma torpedo turrets, however, as they can easily be described on this page. The title "plasma torpedo" would just be much less ambiguous than the current one as to what this page is about. --<font color="MidnightBlue">Jugus (<font color="Gray">Talk  | <font color="Gray">Contribs ) 10:57, 3 April 2016 (EDT)


 * Agreed. That would work. -- NightHammer (talk)(contribs) 11:01, 3 April 2016 (EDT)