Talk:Mantle

The Mantle was not a government - it was "awarded" to them by someone else, hinted to be the Precursors, and handed down to humans, who became as a consequence Reclaimers. I'm pretty sure the full name was the Mantle of Guardianship. Honour Light Your Way -   Kora ‘Morhek   The Battle-Net  My Conquests.  04:18, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree with your concept of the "Mantle of Guardianship".

The "handing down" of the mantle could come from another species, or perhaps more of a religeous notion, if the Forerunners worshipped the Precursors. However, it could also be part of an appointation of position, given by Forerunner government leadership, like a religeous 'oath" given to superiors, or something along those lines. I suggest this because it appears that in Terminal 7, the rampant AI makes a point of saying they had "rescinded" the mantle.    It should also be noted that the AI's continuing statement was that it was "with far more consideration than it was granted".  This is reminiscent of people making vows and oaths without bothering to understand the full ramifications of the decision to do so.  It also points out that their decision to abandon it was not a lightly determined course of action; it was taken very seriously and with good cause.

It's interesting to note that the Rampant AI was essentially doing to the Forerunners what the Heretic Elite was doing to the Covenant in Halo 2. It sounds as though the Rampant AI was convinced in the superiority of the Flood as a species, and therefore felt it invalidated the oaths of the Mantle.

The mantle appears to be a "prime directive" statement of authority and guardianship over other species/races. Those that "wear" the mantle are those that are required to act as guardians over all other forms of life. This also includes things like cataloging species, and doing what's necessary to ensure the survival of these species. To 'protect all life" appears to be the basic foundation of it's principles. This would include acting as a protector of genetic diversity to strengthen species.  This must have caused some issues with regards to determining whether to protect or destroy the flood species when it proved to be so volitile.

The rampant AI takes a very cynical view of this (Terminal 5 on legendary): "Your history is an appalling chronicle of overindulgence and self-appointed authority. You have spent millennia [navel-gazing] while the universe has continued to evolve. And now you claim the Mantle is justification for impeding nature's inevitable refinement?"

This is similar to arguments agains Historical preservation societies that attempt to mandate that older ways of doing things must be protected, even if it means limiting the ability to advance. Almost as though the rampant AI had said, 'preservation is justification for impeding progress?

It would appear that the Rampant AI noted by the terminal has given up the "mantle's" concepts of diversity and species protection in-favor of the flood's concept of unifying the galaxy through it's infestation. Offering eternal life, eternal companionship, etc. in a compound intelligence setting.

As a side note.. this article should be linked from the occurances of the word "mantle" in the terminal transcriptions (maybe as a footnote?). I'd do it, but I'm very new and don't know how. -Deadguy71 24.73.77.230 21:13, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

In the trivia section, this following item is a baseless suggestion, isn't it??
 * It could also refer to the planet like object in the legendary ending of Halo 3.

Using that logic, and precedent, Masterchief's helmet could be named Mantle too, and that trivial fact should be posted. I'd remove it, but as noted above.. I'm new and don't want to mess everything up. 24.73.77.230 21:25, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Failure of Logic
Is it just me, or is the entire logical premise of the Mantle an outright fool's errand?

The Mantle was the cause of the Forerunner's defeat, near-extinction, and exodus of shame out of Milky Way, and the reason that the Flood remained a threat to life 100,000 years later. It renders the galaxy's inhabitants vulnerable not only to the Flood, but also conflict amongst themselves, exploitation of weaker species, and other threats from outside the galaxy, be it more Flood or some other dangerous force.

If anything, it not only made the lesser species of the galaxy vulnerable, it left the Forerunner sluggish, taciturn, and most of all, weak and naive when their territory and dominion had been compromised.

Besides, the entire notion that life and biodiversity can be protected at all cost to everything else leads to the kind of failure and death that resulted from the Forerunner-Flood War.

A major problem point is the existence of the Flood itself; that, if anything, would logically render the Mantle and all it entails as futile and irrelevant. The existence of any life anywhere as long as the Flood exists renders the rationale for preserving life and even biodiversity pointless and doomed to failure. Given its sheer versatility and virulence, the Flood are not only an "antithesis" to life, they are effectively an invincible force that renders life's existence as an exercise in ultimate futility and naivette.

If anything, the Flood should make it clear that as long as it exists, there can be no life of any kind whatsoever anywhere and any time in the universe. Even using the rationale that biodiversity in a galaxy is a sure-fire way of ensuring it's biosphere's existence is foolish and utterly irrelevant; all conceivable forms of life are subject to the Flood, so it doesn't matter how biodiverse any ecology is- it will be consumed all the same.

The other side to this is that the existence of life itself, anywhere and at any time, especially in an abundant location, is precisely what the Flood need to survive and achieve their victory. The fact that there is life means that the Flood has already won no matter what one does.

The Flood themselves render the Mantle or any other similar ideology obsolete; life cannot be protected no matter what one does if life still exists. Living things will always die, fight, and struggle, and ultimately be overcome by any myriad of cosmic forces and the Flood.

Biology is an ultimately fragile, immensely improbable existence that is at constant risk in a violent, relentless, chaotic, and haphazard universe that is indifferent to its existence or absence.

The Forerunners should have realized this, for the very nature of the universe itself and the existence of life's frailty and sheer improbability combined with the presence of the Flood and/or other similar entities renders the logic behind the Mantle baseless and short-sighted.

At their level, they should have realized, the only things that they really need are themselves, resources, and habitat, because they themselves is all they really should ever need. There is nothing that such a culture could gain from weaker, vastly inferior cultures and species that they couldn't invent and provide for themselves without outside help or interferrence. --Exalted Obliteration 03:35, July 17, 2010 (UTC)